Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post Reply
User avatar
John Faulkner, Skegness
Posts: 6259
Joined: 19 Sep 2014 15:55
Location: Skegness, Lincolnshire. JO03dd
Contact:

Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by John Faulkner, Skegness » 09 Jul 2019 10:25

I saw this mentioned in another thread and wondered what the chances were of UK DXers receiving tropo from Kaliningrad. I checked my meteor scatter log to see which Kaliningrad stations I have received, and this might suggest that a few frequencies could indeed stand a chance.

101.8 22-01-15 RUS Business FM, Kaliningrad/Ul. Gagarina 110 (KA) 1332km 1kW v
102.5 09-10-14 RUS Radio Mayak, Kaliningrad/Ul. Shevchenko 2 (KA) 1329km 20kW h
107.2 15-01-17 RUS Radio Komsomolskaya Pravda, Kaliningrad (KA) 1325km 4kW v

107.2 has been the most particularly regular, not because it is on an empty channel. They are all empty channels here. But note the polarisation.

daveB
Posts: 1430
Joined: 07 Oct 2014 16:49

Re: Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by daveB » 09 Jul 2019 11:37

If 102.5 is clear I would venture to suggest R Mayak is the best bet if you can catch it around the top of the hour - when the haunting "Moscow Nights" is played. That can be discerned even on the weakest of signals.

Is it possible this is hiding on an I/Q file recorded during the excellent tropo at the end of June 2019? which tended to be in that direction.
Locatio: Sittingbourne, Kent JO01ji
SDRPlay, AirSpyMini, RTL dongles, SB920s, Yamaha TX930. 5 ele compact yagi 20ft agl - 120 deg. FM5 - 80 deg, FM5 -180 deg. OIRT dipole and 3-ele Moxon - 80 deg. Shielded magnetic loop 0.1-200 MHz

pe1etr
Posts: 1852
Joined: 07 Oct 2014 00:40
Location: Blackpool, UK

Re: Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by pe1etr » 09 Jul 2019 11:54

I remember receiving Poland ( Baltic coast) via tropo in 1999 when living in Hull. Didn't a UK dxer get Kaliningrad then? Can't remember the exact date but it was June/July.
Peter

User avatar
John Faulkner, Skegness
Posts: 6259
Joined: 19 Sep 2014 15:55
Location: Skegness, Lincolnshire. JO03dd
Contact:

Re: Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by John Faulkner, Skegness » 09 Jul 2019 12:39

Yes, as 102.5 is horizontal, most DXers would probably be best trying for that. That Mayak theme is indeed haunting and very distinctive.

I remember the tropo to the Baltic coast of Poland in 1999. My loggings were lost due to hard drive failure. I don't remember anybody having Kaliningrad then, but then my memory isn't what it used to be Geoffrey. Anybody know more about this?

pe1etr
Posts: 1852
Joined: 07 Oct 2014 00:40
Location: Blackpool, UK

Re: Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by pe1etr » 09 Jul 2019 12:50

John Faulkner, Skegness wrote:
09 Jul 2019 12:39
Yes, as 102.5 is horizontal, most DXers would probably be best trying for that. That Mayak theme is indeed haunting and very distinctive.

I remember the tropo to the Baltic coast of Poland in 1999. My loggings were lost due to hard drive failure. I don't remember anybody having Kaliningrad then, but then my memory isn't what it used to be Geoffrey. Anybody know more about this?
Might have been VHF Band III or UHF TV rather than FM. My memory is much worse than yours
Eric.

User avatar
PFM907
Posts: 1162
Joined: 19 Jun 2017 06:38
Location: offline. off air.

Re: Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by PFM907 » 09 Jul 2019 12:57

Interesting topic. Kaliningrad DX does not work out in Germany on VHF-2 FM, so why would that be possible in the UK? I doubt it.
From my experience I must admit that since 2003 I have been trying hard to receive Kenigsberg=Kaliningradskaya Oblast from Germany on FM.
Without success yet. My furthest catches have been Lębork/ Skórowo Nowe (10 kW) and Gdańsk/ Chwaszczyno (120 kW).
Both deliver decent signals during the slightest high pressure over the Baltic Sea along the MV coastline easily.

I have been trying in Schleswig-Holstein as well as the total coastline from MV (Boltenhagen, Poel, Kuehlungsborn, Warnemuende, Ahrenshoop, Ruegen).
No chance! No way to receive it either on Bornholm (too many danish and polish stations occupying the VHF-2 band) or on Gotland (too many swedish).

I had the possibility to climb up towers and was trying from top locations such as:
https://www.kuehlungsborn.de/kuehlungsb ... storf.html
https://www.seebad-hiddensee.de/informa ... hiddensee/
https://www.mv-schloesser.de/de/locatio ... s-granitz/
https://www.ruegen-hotel.de/

Without any luck. Kaliningrad was not possible to be received, not even in the 8th floor:
viewtopic.php?t=3872 (400 logs

I have even tried several times when local tx. Garz / Ruegen (operating on 102.5 MHz) went off, but I only had 3 elements.
During those times of maintanance, I have received Thuringia, Saxony, Lower Saxony - up to 500 km.
Even Poland up to Wroclaw/Gora Sleza could be heard with good signals and without any larger efforts.

What I do know is that Veselovka 59.90 MHz and Kenigsberg=Kaliningrad 66.02 kHz have been heard from Flensburg at Oct.,2nd. in 2015:
https://www.rundfunkforum.de/viewtopic. ... &p=1220983
But there is no recording linked to the post, I would loved to hear how that sounds like and how strong / stable these signals can get.

Anyway, I do not think there is any way to get Kenigsberg=Kaliningradskaya oblast on VHF-2 FM (not OIRT-UKF) from Western Europe.
Maybe it is the lack of heigth or the bad xmitter location, maybe it is the low ERP or moreover a combination of both reasons.
This would be worth trying with 10 elements...

The only place I can recommand for the reception of FM signals from Kenigsberg=Kaliningradskaya oblast is Öland (Kalmar).
https://www.rundfunkforum.de/viewtopic. ... d#p1203408
But this is 332 km distance already and the signal was fairly audible at S=3 on a horizontal telescope with only water in-between.

User avatar
PFM907
Posts: 1162
Joined: 19 Jun 2017 06:38
Location: offline. off air.

Re: Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by PFM907 » 09 Jul 2019 13:03

by the way John your MSc logs from KAL are amazing! it is absolutely impossible to catch KAL in Germany via MSc or Es because it is much too close.
so you might be considering yourself in the extremely lucky situation to be able receiving KAL via Msc or Es

User avatar
John Faulkner, Skegness
Posts: 6259
Joined: 19 Sep 2014 15:55
Location: Skegness, Lincolnshire. JO03dd
Contact:

Re: Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by John Faulkner, Skegness » 09 Jul 2019 15:02

Interesting PFM and thank you for the detailed reply.

I only guessed that tropo might be possible from the UK because of my meteor scatter reception, which proves that these signals get out. propagating well beyond their coverage area.

Here are two YouTube videos of my reception:


107.2 Radio Komsomolskaya Pravda, Kaliningrad 0503 15-01-17 1332 km
https://youtu.be/Lvwa-0DmMEU

101.8 Business FM, Kaliningrad (1kW) 0618 22-01-15 1332 km
https://youtu.be/tQhpdER-ce4

User avatar
PFM907
Posts: 1162
Joined: 19 Jun 2017 06:38
Location: offline. off air.

Re: Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by PFM907 » 11 Jul 2019 08:30

Physically, it should be possible, indeed. However, experience has shown that it might be almost unachievable...
But why not give it a try? I guess on VHF-2, every log is possible (physically). I have seen more difficult ones.

I am going to Kalmar region this summer, worth checking the Kaliningrad frequencies out from the Swedish mainland.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Paradisefm - Malta's N° 1 in dance and electronic
qths: Sliema MLT / Bavaria / Nth GER / Keitum-Sylt

useful: mwlist.org / intervalsignals.net / asiawaves.net / fmlist.org

User avatar
John Faulkner, Skegness
Posts: 6259
Joined: 19 Sep 2014 15:55
Location: Skegness, Lincolnshire. JO03dd
Contact:

Re: Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by John Faulkner, Skegness » 11 Jul 2019 15:03

I have no doubt that you are right PFM. If Kaliningrad tropo has not been received in Germany then the UK probably stands less of a chance. But the conditions might just be good enough one day. We can only hope.

Tim Bucknall
Posts: 3066
Joined: 01 Oct 2014 14:55
Location: Now stranded in Congleton
Contact:

Re: Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by Tim Bucknall » 12 Jul 2019 08:41

Jurgen Bartels has had “Konigsberg” on tropo, it’s one of our favorite conversation topics
So it is possible in Germany

Given the lack of clear channels in the uk
I would listen for a tv audio channel like 91.75 (still counts as fm after all)

Edit: FMlist has just removed R4 Kaliningrad - it was listed last week
Rx: Burkhardt Reuter RDR54D1, Elad FDM-S2, Airspy HF+ w/ HS Publications 6 Element R3 -R5 Yagi on rooftop rotator V/H polarization options. Pira P275 RDS analyser

User avatar
PFM907
Posts: 1162
Joined: 19 Jun 2017 06:38
Location: offline. off air.

Re: Chances of receiving Kaliningrad via tropo on band 2

Post by PFM907 » 12 Jul 2019 14:31

Interesting! Haven't read about this before. :)

From which QTH?

Channel/frequency? Guess the easiest should be 65.9 MHz Veselovka !?

Are there any recordings?
Would like to know how the fading sounds like on low power across the sea and how strong those can get.


So R-04 with video at 85,25 MHz and audio at 91,75 is no longer active any more???
What a shame. Both frequencies could be easily heard with a normal world band receiver even with a small wire.

I have heard Kenigsberg=Kaliningrad TV on 91.7 MHz in the Masuren / Poland. Weak signal, but it was there... (while "normal" FM Radio was not).

Post Reply

Return to “VHF Band 2, OIRT & DAB”